Post by mooglar (Malim Vincible) on Jul 20, 2005 9:57:05 GMT -5
Ki Vaan wrote:
>>I completely agree with that. What is truly sad (and extremely ironic in a Shakespearian kind of way) is that Anakin himself is the one that causes (or at least contributes to) her death, making the visions he had of her dying during (or just after) childbirth a reality. Everything he did to prevent her death was actually setting it up to happen. Perhaps that's what Lucas was going for. Who knows?<<
Clearly, that's what Lucas is going for. I was thinking about this the other day, and I started thinking about how this plays into free will. I mean, the Force gives Anakin a vision of Padme dying that causes him to turn to the dark side and kill her. The vision comes true because of the vision itself, so it seems as if Anakin's free will is abrogated, because once Anakin sees the vision is must come true, right? (Since Anakin's visions always come true). It seems as if the Force has determined Anakin's destiny without Anakin having much choice about it.
But then, it occurred to me that the vision only shows Padme dying in childbirth, not how that death came to pass. It seems to me that the Force was presenting Anakin with a choice: it was showing him that Padme was going to die in childbirth, but how she was going to end up dying was what Anakin could control. That is to say, I think Padme was going to die in childbirth no matter what. But, had Anakin followed Yoda's advice and let go of his fear of loss, Padme would have died with Anakin by her side, probably because of the Emperor or something, and Anakin would have remained a Jedi and been part of Luke and Leia's lives. If Anakin chose the dark path, the path of refusing to accept that loss is a natural part of life, he would ultimately end up being the reason Padme died.
Does that make sense? Anakin couldn't prevent Padme's death. He could only choose whether or not to accept it, and thereby whether or not he would be the agent of her demise. The Force gave him the opportunity to choose the light path of acceptance or the dark path of attachment and fear of loss. But Anakin wasn't doomed to cause Padme's death. That was up to him.
>>I completely agree with that. What is truly sad (and extremely ironic in a Shakespearian kind of way) is that Anakin himself is the one that causes (or at least contributes to) her death, making the visions he had of her dying during (or just after) childbirth a reality. Everything he did to prevent her death was actually setting it up to happen. Perhaps that's what Lucas was going for. Who knows?<<
Clearly, that's what Lucas is going for. I was thinking about this the other day, and I started thinking about how this plays into free will. I mean, the Force gives Anakin a vision of Padme dying that causes him to turn to the dark side and kill her. The vision comes true because of the vision itself, so it seems as if Anakin's free will is abrogated, because once Anakin sees the vision is must come true, right? (Since Anakin's visions always come true). It seems as if the Force has determined Anakin's destiny without Anakin having much choice about it.
But then, it occurred to me that the vision only shows Padme dying in childbirth, not how that death came to pass. It seems to me that the Force was presenting Anakin with a choice: it was showing him that Padme was going to die in childbirth, but how she was going to end up dying was what Anakin could control. That is to say, I think Padme was going to die in childbirth no matter what. But, had Anakin followed Yoda's advice and let go of his fear of loss, Padme would have died with Anakin by her side, probably because of the Emperor or something, and Anakin would have remained a Jedi and been part of Luke and Leia's lives. If Anakin chose the dark path, the path of refusing to accept that loss is a natural part of life, he would ultimately end up being the reason Padme died.
Does that make sense? Anakin couldn't prevent Padme's death. He could only choose whether or not to accept it, and thereby whether or not he would be the agent of her demise. The Force gave him the opportunity to choose the light path of acceptance or the dark path of attachment and fear of loss. But Anakin wasn't doomed to cause Padme's death. That was up to him.